How much is too much for this Obak card?

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=300248858954&ssPageName=STRK:MEWA:IT&ih=020

Thanks,
Pete

That's a pretty nice one for that series. That price doesn't seem unreasonable at all, especialy if it's one of the tougher players.

Jay

All 1909s are tough.

This card is frameless, and assumed handcut by TPG. From the looks of it, it will only grade at AUT. It presents at VG/EX or better (which is top shelf for T212-1). Brocklemann is selling his sets by card, and one can see the prices he is asking.

The main issue is that demand is there on 1909s. Unless more than one set builder needs the card, it generally goes for less than it should. They are just to rare to collect by enough people. Supply is tough, but demand isn't. At some point people will realize just how damned tough these cards are to find.

To answer the question, the card bid on this card is MORE than reasonable.

DELETED

"This card is frameless, and assumed handcut by TPG."

What's "TPG"? Is it a certainty that if there is no frame that it's handcut and will receive no better than an AUT grade? Does being handcut hurt the value the same as if it was trimmed? Thanks

not positive but I think TPG=The Professional Graders

Jay

TPG=Third-Party Graders

nolemmings wrote:TPG=Third-Party Graders

That's what I meant by TPG

zouraspm wrote:Is it a certainty that if there is no frame that it's handcut and will receive no better than an AUT grade? Does being handcut hurt the value the same as if it was trimmed?

Good question. Were all frameless backs in the 09 Obak set 'handcut' at the factory? I'm not sure. Seems plausible, and as Brian said, that's what the graders 'assume'. Does everyone agree with them?

A 'handcut' card will receive the same AUT grade as a trimmed card, but that doesn't necessarily mean their value will be affected in the same way. The value of a card with a sloppy trim would obviously take more of a hit than one that was neatly 'handcut' at the factory in 1909.

If this one is indeed 'handcut', the cutter sure had a steady hand. And if all frameless backs are handcut, then I think this one was a nice buy.

from tbob:

"The 1909 Obaks were issued with two backs, one has a frame on them and the other does not. It was always assumed that the frameless cards were hand cut from sheets and therefore trimmed. For many year a lot of PCL card collectors, including myself, argued with PSA and SGC who refused to grade them. Then both companies began grading these cards as "authentic." Lately I have noticed more and more of the frameless back cards are beginning to get numerical grades. The thought now is that just maybe the long believed theory of hand cutting from sheets may not be correct (or perhaps they are being trimmed in a precise manner to make them gradeable). I don't think anyone knows the true answer. I can tell you that in my set I have some frameless backs which have managed to get numerical grades. The ones that obviously look handcut still get authentic grades. What does all this mean? Based on the prices I have seen recently for 1909 Obaks which have nice eye appeal but which are frameless and thus could get the "authentic" grade, it seems like collectors are willing to pay nice prices for them because of their scarcity. I may be in the minority but I would prefer a nice looking "authentic" 1909 Obak with frameless back over an SGC 10 or 20 which is hammered any day of the week. I hope this answers your question, there is just a lot of confusion existing surrounding the frameless back cards."