Full Count VCI

ItsOnlyGil wrote:There has been a downward adjustment in the value of some, maybe all, e107 cards. And maybe not "all". Assuming that this card has a history of selling much higher than $2000; one question which eludes me is whether the downward price adjustment of this set was too great. If so, the set could experience a spike in prices in the short term which will recoup some of the paper losses observed.

If this is a fantasy, then the appreciation term which you cite, Mark, of two years must yield a total price equal to: 3.75% x 2years x triple = $2450 anticipated selling price in two years.



I find that this is quire believable.
So, lets look at the card:

The player represented is and average fielding, light hitting ss with 15 years in the NL: beginning in 1892 - so this is likely the rookie card of a common player. There is no advantage here.

The card is the highest graded by SGC of four and it is graded vg/ex. There is value here, although possibly transient. This value is the nicest card of this player - of possible interest to collectors of the e107 set. A very thin market, and a relatively unimportant card in the set.

All in all, not an overwhelming suggestion, but imho, a good one. I offer to purchase 1/8th ownership in this card for $250.
I have cash available now. If this transaction is going down, please tell me when and where to send the money.

Very nice breakdown Gil.

A few things I don't like about the card/E107's:
1) The fact that this player is available across many different type cards, which I think hurts the overall price of a common player in the E107 set.

2) I'm a little skidish with this set, since I lost quite a bit of money on a few cards because I bought way too high, and had to sell low. I lost pretty close to 50%, on each of two. I guess that's what happens when the market gets flooded with a ton of cards that were nearly impossible to find 6 months ago.

Edited to add: I just sold the O'Connor, so looks like I won't be keeping it. 70 cents on the dollar. But at least I'm free and clear of E107s.


What I do like:
1) the fact that this is a very high grade E107 (in the upper 85%)

2) $2000 would be a fairly good price to get this card for. The upswing seems very good.

3) THE MUSTACHE


Edited: Dave brings up a valid point, and I do agree that we should take a few cards into consideration before we jump into it, and then take a vote.

******I would be interested in going in on a few collective card purchases if we find some good cards out there. Maybe have our own group of cards and a section devoted to the owners? I think this was stated earlier, and I like the concept.

The reason I don't like this e107....

While I sort of agree Mark, Dave didn't get this for too bad of a price...he still bought it for $1762. A month later for the purposes of an "investment" the group here is considering Dave a better than 10% upswing on what he paid... This also wasn't a card that fail through the cracks on ebay, it was in a major auction house (REA). E107's are in my opinion definitely a tricky deal right now. I am not sure how anyone can say this would be the best bet for a return investment 6 months, a year or two years from now. Could this go for $3000 a year from now? Sure. Could it go for $1650 a year from now? Sure.

I know these are considered "rare" or "scarce"...but wasn't the same true of Tango Eggs, Mello Mints and other issues which now seem to go for a percentage of what they did just a few years ago?

When looking at a card as an "investment" you have to play the game of high grade or scarce type. To me...this is borderline scarce type...at least to the point of picking this as THE card to go after as a group. I'm not a high grade guy...I like the scarce stuff. To me, give me a low grade beater Darby Chocolate card and what you pay for it right now you'll have much better odds of being in the green if you want to sell even four months from now.

Just not sure if folks should jump on the first thing out of the gate. Especially when your talking about buying in at better than 10% over what this exact card went for 30 days ago. JMO.

What we are doing here is certainly not well, defined.
But I do not perceive the vg/ex e107 common as "the" Full Count card.
I see it as the first specific suggestion for which sufficient support is being sought for acquisition.
Heck, sombody may opt to pick up the remaining 7/8ths of the cost.

Suggestions are anticipated to come up from time to time, as opportunities occur.
When sufficient funding is available, we could win the lots sought.
They could be multiple card lots or single ones.

The suggestions may be seen as good ones or not so good. Everyone sees things differently.
Personally, I'm thinking that there could be a 10%+ positive e107 market adjustment within 3 months. And I'd be in favor of selling at that point, rather than waiting out the longer term appreciation potential (but 1/8th is not controlling interest).

Then again, this "market adjustment" could exist only in my imagination.

But this is all for fun. A $250 investment with the hope of making 10%+ within three months = looking for $30. or so! Not gonna make any of us rich. But one of the things we could have "going".

Gil-

Yes I understand what your saying. And I certainly wasn't trying to reign on anyone's parade. I see nothing at all wrong with different members putting up certain cards in this thread as "oppurtunities" and if in fact one of the cards gets enough interest (as in 100% cost) by a few members...so be it.

I'm sure there could always be 5-10 different cards up for consideration...and just a matter of how much interest is drawn towards any one of them.

I'm assuming the way it would work in any purchase is the person with the majority of "shares" would be the card holder? Am curious to see how it would work if say 4 people each went in at 25% on a card...who holds it then? And how would desicions be made on a stalling of opinions on when to sell, etc?

asphaltman76 wrote:ust not sure if folks should jump on the first thing out of the gate. Especially when your talking about buying in at better than 10% over what this exact card went for 30 days ago. JMO.

Agreed. This is certainly an interesting concept and something I'd consider getting involved with. But perhaps a more methodical approach would benefit. With some careful planning I think we could make it work. I also agree that in most cases, scarcity is the name of the game here. I come across an auction every once in a while where I'd say to myself "if only I had the $". Well next time that happens I'd just pitch the card to the group for more opinions and possibly go forward on it.

Another concern of mine is privacy. I think these sorts of discussions should take place in a private forum on Full Count, which isn't difficult to set up after creating a usergroup. All I'd need to set one up is a list of names of all interested parties.

One other side note: I've never been an investor in cards. I've never bought a card to flip. I get too attached to the cards I buy to let them go so easily. So I'm not sure if this is 100% suited for me but I'm willing to give it a go.

THe other way to turn an investment is semi-rarity involving lots.

I'm made some bad desicions over the last few years (who hasn't)...but from the $100 I started with in my paypal three years ago i've come a long way flipping that into cards that are a bit more exciting.

Hey Ben, you can definitely count me in on this concept.

I've been wanting to do something like this since I've been in the hobby, which isn't very long (1 1/2 years).

I think we should also set up some ground rules for our "community", like who holds the cards, what to do in case of a stalemate, etc.

Here are a few of my opinions (and only opinions):

Who holds the card? I think all the cards in the community should go to a centralized location. We have either Mark or Ben hold the cards (if they want to), or someone else. Within the owners community section of the board, we load each thread with multiple pics of each card, and all the information that accompanies the card (where it was purchased, when, how much, when it was sold, total profit, are the profits made from the card going to be reinvested in the next card, etc.)

Additional Costs? Those in the owner's community should split the bill for a Safety Deposit box at a bank (or similar), and a membership to VCP (which for the year is $99). Not sure of the cost of a safety deposit box.

If there are only 4 owners to a card and the decision to sell is at a stalemate (50:50), what do we do? The easiest way to answer this question is don't get attached to the cards. I also think that with a gentleman discussion, this can be taken care of pretty easily. Everyone should realize that there is a risk involved, and if you don't mind the risk, I think this could be a lot of fun.

Please do not consider offering your opinion as potentially raining on my parade. The opposite is the case, I value your opinions very highly, and appreciate any offered.
I have no experience with this area of our hobby. And the insight which you may offer will be of significant value to me.

However, with regard to adjudicating potential disputes such as when to sell, I recommend the standard eendy, beendy, banida, roe; chicken variation method of deciding: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eeny,_meeny,_miny,_moe

The forum's polling feature will come in very handy when deciding matters such as what to buy and when to sell.

What I see working is as follows:

- Members create a new "pitch" thread whenever a potential target arises. The thread starter would attempt to convince the group that their target is worthwhile and end with a suggested price level for a snipe.

- People could respond with "I'm in" if they're interested and from there, the shares would be divvied up.

- Going in on someone's pitch would be entirely optional. So if a proposal is attractive, many will want in and the group could pursue it aggressively.

I go out to my pool for a few hours and i have tons of posts to read.


Yes, i agree the E107 Cross is not a card that will gain big $ in a short time. We should be looking for a card that is and will be in high demand in 1-2 years but the problem is, hundreds of collectors are doing the same thing.

And, whos to say Dave will let the E107 Cross go for anything under $2,500.

I am in on any type of card we agree on. Another option is a set. Maybe look and see what auctions are coming up with nice Caramel or Tobbacco cards in them.

keep the opinions coming.

Mark

Mark-

yes, my experience with Dave S is he would just as soon sit on something as to sell it for less than what he feels it should be at. that is unless you have some cubbies to trade him.

What to look for"?
When you find the noodle under the haystack how to recognize it?
1) Aren't all cards priced correctly?
2) If the economy is not doing well, will baseball cards?

The noodle which I like is the e107 Cross, except stronger: rarer and in better condition.
Like a PSA6 e99.
You infrequently see e99s + you essentially never see them in Ex.
Or at least, I don't.

But how can I afford such a noodle, if I could even find it?
The only thing which I have here in the five figures is my mortgage.
Even my vehicle is now under $10K.

So, Im realistic. Cross is what I can do.
Attractive to type set collecrtors.
Little risk, little gain
But fun just the same.






But e107s may not have hit bottom yet.
I made that mistake with silver years ago.
I bought in after it had dropped 85% of its total fall (from $50/oz) when it hesitated.
It then continued down and stayed there.
Offsetting this stoopidity is that I also sold near the top.

fisherboy7 wrote:The forum's polling feature will come in very handy when deciding matters such as what to buy and when to sell.

What I see working is as follows:

- Members create a new "pitch" thread whenever a potential target arises. The thread starter would attempt to convince the group that their target is worthwhile and end with a suggested price level for a snipe.

- People could respond with "I'm in" if they're interested and from there, the shares would be divvied up.


- Going in on someone's pitch would be entirely optional. So if a proposal is attractive, many will want in and the group could pursue it aggressively.

This sounds good, Ben.
But these conversations should not be open to the general public.

I think we are all in agreement there. We close those discussions from the public.

We could buy some Turkey Red Football cards
Actually my little Brother bought this Card, don't get me started
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=260244609572&ssPageName=STRK:MEWN:IT&ih=016

Hey guys, I'll be creating the usergroup and private forum later today. From there we can hammer out the details further. Everyone who has expressed interest in this thread will be added to the group. Anyone else who wants to get involved can either post here or PM me.

Nice!

Moving quickly....I like it.

Just letting people know that this project is underway and has gone underground.

We'll keep the forum up to date on its progress.

hehe very nice guys...i suggest u go after something that louchios and ireland will be fighting each other for 1 year from now...like a common e96 in a psa6 holder that's worth about $500 but end up being a 5k card.