Card Scarcity: Myth Busters

1. What are some cards/sets that are NOT AS SCARCE as their reputation holds them to be?

2. What are some cards/sets that are SCARCER than most people think?

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I'll start us out with a few...


1. Not as Scarce:

-E90-1 Mitchell: We had a thread about this a few months ago. No longer the "Wagner of e-cards", it might not even be a top 5 or even top 10 scarcity in the set. I think most collectors have realized this about the Mitchell though, so it might not be the best example.

-T206 UZIT backs: There are more of these out there than people think. They're still very tough, but they don't deserve the reputation of being an "ultra rare" t206 back, imo. Especially after the huge find that appeared in a REA auction not too long ago. I'd rank them below the Red Hindu back for example (not sure if that's going out on a limb at all).


2. Scarcer than commonly thought:

-The E104 set: Type 3's are well known scarcities (some with only a single example known), but I think people underrate the scarcity type 1's and 2's. They are very tough cards to find, especially with the Nadja backs. I think a couple hundred bucks for a g/vg type 1 or 2 common is a bargain considering how tough they actually are.


Looking forward to hearing everyone's thoughts on this topic.

underrated:

-coupon type I's...which I believe should be t206...these are on par w/some of the tougher backs...lenox...uzit...red hindu...and are very underpriced
-e97 variations...come up for sale so infrequently
-e102 miller fielding
-33 butter cream ruth

over-hyped

-many supposedly one of a kind cards...which are not...like many
e107's

-

Still Scarce IMO -
T216's (Peoples Tobacco) and T214's (Victory Tobacco) still seem to remain very tough
and are very under valued IMO.


Not as scarce IMO -
Ben is correct in regards to the E90-1 M. Mitchell. Still tough but not unobtainable anymore.
There are so many other cards in the E90-1 set that are so much tougher.
We've also seen an abundance of E107's pop up the last year or so. If someone wanted to
add an example to their collection, now is definitely the time to do so.

Tony A.

underrated-are type 1 coupon-they are probably rarer than Uzit and a fraction of the cost. Same goes for Red Cross type 1.
The Mino t216 is also rare. I have seen a few Benders but have not been able to add it to my collection.
Another is T213-they are way more rare than t206 and can be had for just about the same price.


The d303 issue is probably more rare than collectors think. I have seen very few of these and very little conversation on them as well.

are pirates back still desireable to T collectors? i know the baseball players seldom come up (or being hoarded when they do), but since they're not an american product and i can get a confucius or lao tzu rookie card are they any different than the churchman ruths or some other obscure foreign issue? i've always thought these were overrated.

i guess there's a potential for a complete set and they use the same poses of the american Ts is the allure.

I consider the t215 pirates pretty damn special and would love to have one. it's one of the most ornate...and neautiful backs in my opinion. as you say...they never come up and are so expensive. I couldn't pay a few grand for a common...I won't do it. I'd rather make one from my oriental characters cards a la kevin!

To me they are in the same league as t214 victory...from a desirability standpoint...churchmans and the like are like strip cards to me...not so great!

I agree with everyone's points so far except for T215 Red Cross being underrated (both types).

A ton of T215's hit the market this past year or so. Not sure if there was a recent large find or two, but I think their reputation as being scarce has diminished. I recall a large lot (50+ cards) in Mastro and several smaller lots of low grade, back damaged T215's (6-8 cards each) on ebay this year. As well as a bunch of singles (I managed to land one for myself as a type card).

Still a tough set that I'm a fan of, but not as scarce as previously perceived to be, imo.

ullmandds wrote:

-many supposedly one of a kind cards...which are not...like many
e107's

-

which e107's are supposedly one of a kind? I have never heard anyone claim this before.

overrated:
t206 Wagner/Plank/Magie

Good thread.

I think these cards are overrated:

T206 Variations especially Smith, Elberfield, Kleinow, and the Polar Bear only variations.
E90 Jackson


Underrated:

E103
Obaks
T213-2

Cards that used to be underrated that aren't anymore:

Zeenuts
T213-1 Coupon
M116
E90-3
E98

Diamond Star high numbers are underrated. Try putting a set together sometime and you will find out just how tough they are. Underrated and unappreciated except by a few, Colgan red borders.

Overrated, t206 variations with ink missing. T205 variations tied to just one back, the big 3 from the t207 set. 1940 Play Ball cards featuring players from the Deadball Era.

Jay

oops...I misspoke...I combined 2 thoughts. I believe E107's are overrated in addition to supposed one of a kind cards.

imo e104s are hugely underrated...some bread issues are overrated relative to their scarcity (d304s, d322s).

I think most of the T215s that hit the market were type 2. I am not 100% but type 1s are a bit more rare

cccc wrote:imo e104s are hugely underrated...some bread issues are overrated relative to their scarcity (d304s, d322s).

Agreed, D cards were crazy for a while and are still pretty high. D304's and D322's are cool cards though. Wasn't it a Goodwin auction where a bunch of high grade D304's went for obscene prices? I think they've come down to earth a bit since.

Jim Rivera cfc1909 wrote:I am not 100% but type 1s are a bit more rare

That's what I've heard too. There doesn't seem to be that much of a scarcity difference between the two types though. I'd guess maybe 60/40 type 2 to type 1.

The T215 I picked up this year happens to be a type 1:

I consider the t215 pirates pretty damn special and would love to have
one. it's one of the most ornate...and beautiful backs in my opinion.
as you say...they never come up and are so expensive. I couldn't pay a
few grand for a common...I won't do it. I'd rather make one from my
oriental characters cards a la kevin!

ah...not as easy as it sounds (it be not gravy). It takes about 15 steps and approx. 8 man-hours....and that's with the skill set and the planets aligned.


Up for trade: One blank front real Pirate back card.
.
.

Overrated:
D304 - Whenever I look at these cards and see the prices they bring I simply shake my head. With the exception of Jack Barry, which is a really cool portrait, most of these cards are ugly as sin. The crazy prices also seem to have brought a fair amount of these cards out of the woodwork too, so the current prices seem to be driven by a mania for the cards rather than the real scarcity factor.

Any "E" card of Cy Young that pictures Irv Young - I have no idea why anyone would pay a Cy Young price for a card picturing Irv, especially when there are a good amount of Cy Young cards out that show Cy in a decent pose.

Underrated:
Worch Cigars - I've been collecting Worch Cigar set for a couple years now and find it very underrated. There are some great photos that aren't found in many other issues and the cards are quite scarce.

1920's American Caramel sets, especially e120 and e121 - In my book, the e120 set should be considered THE comprehensive issue of the 1920's in the same way that t206, Cracker Jack, and 1933 Goudey seem to be for their eras. What seems to hurt them the most is the duplication of many of their poses on other cards as well as strip card lookalike sets which lead to confusion. These cards aren't around in as great a number as people may think.

The tougher 1939-46 Salutation Exhibits - I dabble in this set a little bit and plan on getting serious about it once I finish my BF2 set. If the tougher ones in this set are out there, I'm not seeing them...in any quantity.

How about the myth that all e90-3's are scarce? This is just me speculating, but some cards in the set seem to be much easier to find than others (e.g. Sheckard, Zeider, and especially Schulte). Maybe it's the case of a few cards getting recycled over and over, but it seems like you see an e90-3 Schulte every other week on ebay.




Also, try finding a e90-3 Walsh that's not off register....

Ben...your observation on Schulte is consistent with what I've experienced. Type 3's were marketed in the area where I live and Schulte has been well represented in those finds. Additionally, most I've found are off center.

oaks1912 wrote:Ben...your observation on Schulte is consistent with what I've experienced. Type 3's were marketed in the area where I live and Schulte has been well represented in those finds. Additionally, most I've found are off center.

Thanks Mark. If possible, could you give us a little detail about the E90-3 finds that were made in your area? IE. Estimated number of cards total, which players were the scarcest/most abundant (other than Schulte), and if any cards from other sets were present in the finds? Thanks again!

All my favorite cards are getting ripped on here so I have to at least try to come to their defense.

E90-3s: You're right about schulte and a few other cubs players being much more common than the other players.

There are still some very tough E90-3 cards out there. Like many other issues, they went crazy because a couple folks who have way too much cash spent way too much money on one particular group of them last year.
The prices now on these are great. I'll keep buying, buying, buying if I can.

P.S. There was a pretty large "find" of raw E90-3 cards in the Atlanta area this year.


D304: "ugly"? I disagree.
This set along with D322 are tough, but as you guys mentioned, the money brought them out of the woodwork. Don't get to excited about them being common though. We've seen the same two collections hit the market like 18 times over the past three years.

I agree about the E104s. The type 1 cards are much more plentiful, but type 3s are ridiculously hard to find. I don't think many folks collect them because they're too difficult and they figure they'll never make any progress. Type 2s are obviously not collected cuz one could have the same poses for cheaper with the E90s.

Rob

Ben...I shared some quotes with Pete Calderon several years ago and he posted them on his site (http://www.caramel-cards.com/e903.html). With the exception of two 'outside the hobby' groups which have turned up in this region (that I did not acquire but am aware of), I haven't found any in this region in awhile

I have been trying to pick up T330-2 Piedmont Art Stamps for the last 5 years and they are few and far between. Occasionally I can pick one up inexpensive but generally prices go for 3 times more than I am hoping to pay.

I have thought the T206 Kleinow Boston is over rated and that his NY catching pose is just as tough.

Lee