smoking gun for Clemens

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smoking gun for Clemens

Post by sabrjay on Wed Jul 16, 2008 10:24 am

Here is a link to the ESPN article about reciepts for HGH shipments to Clemens. It's also more proof that if this were Bonds, it would be leading the front page instead being buried.

Clemens HGH shipment

Jay

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Re: smoking gun for Clemens

Post by cccc on Wed Jul 16, 2008 10:34 pm

race may play a part in it, but i don't think it's 100% the reason why. first of all clemens has retired and he's not chasing after the most hallowed record in the sport. personally if bonds get left off the 1st ballot hof, then clemens should suffer the same consequence...of course if they're both convicted (and they should be) then all bets are off.

i did find it funny when i read that when black players go beserk arguing with umpires etc like milton bradley or carl everett they're labeled as hotheads and psychotic...when white players do the same they're labled gritty, hard-nosed, and gamers. might be some truth in that whole argument.
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Re: smoking gun for Clemens

Post by crazylocomerk on Thu Jul 24, 2008 12:47 pm

sabrjay wrote:Here is a link to the ESPN article about reciepts for HGH shipments to Clemens. It's also more proof that if this were Bonds, it would be leading the front page instead being buried.

Clemens HGH shipment

Jay

It could also be that Bonds is kind of an ass and most people don't like his personality, thus he brings it upon himself.
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Re: smoking gun for Clemens

Post by sabrjay on Thu Jul 24, 2008 9:51 pm

Regardless if Bonds is an ass or not, Clemens still gets treated with kid gloves, just as McGwire did. Basically, the press now ignores these guys rather than vilify them the way they have Bonds. Some people will say a lot of it is due to his pursuit and breaking of the most hallowed record in sports. If this were true, then why wasn't McGwire also vilified? He pursued and broke the second most hallowed record.

Mac and Clemens are guilty of the same thing as Bonds, using PEDs and they should be treated the same way.

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Re: smoking gun for Clemens

Post by cccc on Thu Jul 24, 2008 10:10 pm

the difference between mcgwire and bonds is in '98 mac was caught with the then legal creatin while chasing the record...while game of shadows and all these allegations had already came out against bonds when he was after aaron.

also on a sidenote jay i never understood your manlove and blind allegiance to bonds...you said he never admitted to taking peds cow steroids women fertility pills hgh etc etc...but he clearly cheated. i'd prolly put him in the hof post-humously (maybe) because he was a great player but i'd never give him that satisfaction when he's alive.
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Re: smoking gun for Clemens

Post by sabrjay on Thu Jul 24, 2008 11:09 pm

It's not so a much a blind allegiance as wanting to see equal treatment for the all the PED users. Athletes are always going to do whatever they need to in order to try and be the best. I don't really have a problem with that. Let me juice to their heart's content. They are grown ups and can do whatever they want.

The thing about all this that is really disturbing is that there is much more hard evidence against Clemens that there is against Bonds, yet the media doesn't seem to be interested. Bonds would have been burned at the stake already if this same evidence had been brought against him.

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Re: smoking gun for Clemens

Post by ItsOnlyGil on Thu Jul 24, 2008 11:40 pm

Eleven more wins and the Rocket passes Kid Nichols, Spahn and Pud Galvin to move into #5 on the all time list, behind only Young, Johnson, Matty and 'Ol Pete.
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Re: smoking gun for Clemens

Post by ItsOnlyGil on Sun Jul 27, 2008 1:19 am

The claim that today’s weight training programs have given today’s moundsmen pitching arms of a strength superior to their predecessors, or that weight training alone can produce a superior pitcher; is a suggestion open to challenge. The problem with this claim is that there exists no evidence whatsoever that weight training increases pitching velocity. While I’m sure than many, if not most, recognize the importance of weight training in helping their pitchers build endurance, there’s not a pitching coach in the majors today who believes that it can do anything to help their charges’ fastballs. Most weight training is designed to build your maximum strength—the maximum amount of weight that you can lift—not absolute strength—the maximum amount you can lift at the maximum amount of speed; a.k.a., explosive strength—or muscle elasticity, which are the type of strength components that go into pitching velocity. Leo Mazzone, perhaps MLB’s most respected pitching coach, has gone on record regarding building velocity by saying that there is “simply no replacement for picking up a ball and throwing it.” To reiterate, there has not been one iota of evidence produced which shows that weight training increases pitching velocity.
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Re: smoking gun for Clemens

Post by sabrjay on Sun Jul 27, 2008 4:23 am

I don't even buy the endurance argument. All you have to do is look at the sissy boy pitchers out there today that only pitch every 5th day. Thankfully, Ray Halladay and few others pitchers are trying to change this and actively seek to pitch every 4th day.

When today's pitchers start pitching every 4th day and throw 5 or more complete games a year, then I'll be weight lifting as sort of benefit for a pitcher.

Jay

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