T Card Set building

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T Card Set building

Post by bowlingshoeguy on Wed Sep 01, 2010 3:23 pm

We had great threads about the scarcity of these cards, my question is how do they rank if you are trying to build a set (with all variations and without). My guess the easiest (no variations)is T201, followed by T202, but where do they go from there?

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Re: T Card Set building

Post by caramelcard on Thu Sep 02, 2010 3:44 am

This is a good question Lee that I don't think has been asked before that I know of. It's hard to rank all of them because some are so small (T209 colors) and some are collected so infrequently as a set, but I'll give it a try.

I'd rank them like this from easiest to hardest:

T201
T202
T205 (fairly small and not to hard to accumulate a bunch fast)
T206 (not hard, but might take a while)
T212-2 (1910 Obaks without 150 series)
T209-1 color (small but tough to find all of them)
T212-3 (1911 Obaks)
T204 expensive but not too hard
T212-1 (Old English)
T207 (might not ever get Lewis variation)

Different class below (hard to classify cuz I don't know of really any of these complete sets)

T209-2
T210
T211
T213-1, 2, and 3 (1s are hard, but 2s have all the variations, 3s have some tough players to find)
T214
T215
T216
T217






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Re: T Card Set building

Post by BigGuy219 on Thu Sep 02, 2010 5:08 am

I have been working on the T201 set for 11 years, averagine one pickup every 3 years.

Laziness. I has it.
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Re: T Card Set building

Post by sabrjay on Thu Sep 02, 2010 1:00 pm

The ranking are going to depend on how you define the word set. This doesn't impact most sets but it's crucial for the t205 set.

For the t206 set, you need a Wagner and the Doyle variation. From what I know, most people that own a Wagner do not have the set. The Doyle variation really limits the number of complete sets. I know there is one complete set. I'm sure there might be a second. But beyond that, there really are no complete t206 sets out there. Now if you want to eliminate printing variations, then the t206 gets a little easier to complete because you get rid of the Doyle. My guess is that there are more complete t207 sets out there then there are complete t206 sets.

The reason the definition of a set is so crucial to t205s is the almost all the variations exist on the back of the card. Does a complete set only constitute all the front possibilities. Do you include back variations, but only those that appear on multiple brands? Or do you include any variation or error, even if it's just on one back? My thought is that if you agree that, then you have consider each tobacco brand as a separate card in set.

No matter how you define the term set, you need to rank the t205 and t206 sets as much more difficult. These cards are like OJ. Commonly seen but a complete set is neigh impossible


Last edited by sabrjay on Thu Sep 02, 2010 4:35 pm; edited 3 times in total

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Re: T Card Set building

Post by bowlingshoeguy on Thu Sep 02, 2010 4:03 pm

My question was for a master set (all variations) and just one of each cards front (no variations).

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Re: T Card Set building

Post by sabrjay on Thu Sep 02, 2010 4:45 pm

If you are just looking at the fronts, t205 is an easy set. t206 is still almost impossible. I think there are 4 known Doyles so that is the limit on the number of sets.

I'd go:

t201
t202
t205
t212-2
t212-3
t204
t212-1
t209-1
t207
t206
t211

as mentioned before there may not be complete sets of the others

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Re: T Card Set building

Post by mzm55 on Thu Sep 02, 2010 5:10 pm

There are multiple complete T210 sets with a handful of collectors very close to being complete. However, close is a relative term and can mean a decade in this case. One complete T211 set exists with another set being two cards away. There are no complete T209-2 sets for a few reasons. First, many of the cards are just beyond rare (i.e. an example may show up once every 20 years). Second, the checklist is still ambiguous. Most lists are "complete" at 222 cards, however, this is not accurate as unchecklisted cards do exist and at least one card on the checklist possibly does not exist.

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Re: T Card Set building

Post by sabrjay on Thu Sep 02, 2010 5:24 pm

That's a scary thought, that there are more complete sets of t210s than t206s. I knew there was one complete Red Sun set but wasn't sure about the Old Mill set. Thanks for the info.

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Re: T Card Set building

Post by crazylocomerk on Thu Sep 02, 2010 7:06 pm

I don't believe there is a single known complete set of T216's (even if you mixed and matched any/all of the back types).

If you break it down by back type, there have been no confirmed complete sets of MINOs and Virginia Extras.

And as for Kottons.....I don't know of any complete sets even if you combined the 3 Kotton back types. I know someone that is 81% of the way complete, but that's the highest completion percentage I know of.
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Re: T Card Set building

Post by Jim Rivera cfc1909 on Thu Sep 02, 2010 7:47 pm

There was a 211 set in REA from a hobby vet that recently past, that was missing 1 card (Fritz) for completion. I think this one is in addition to what Zack mentioned.
I believe there are more than 4 Doyles known but still no more than 8 so that keeps 206 at less than 10.

210 sets are known but I still think there may be a few added to the checklist over time just like 209-2.

another great thread for FC.
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Re: T Card Set building

Post by mzm55 on Thu Sep 02, 2010 9:19 pm

Hey Jim,

The T211 set was missing one card, however, the winner of the auction was able to obtain the missing card shortly after winning the lot, making the first complete set. One other set is now missing two cards.

Also, I agree with you about T210s. I think it's very possible that an unchecklisted example will surface sometime in the future.

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Re: T Card Set building

Post by rman444 on Thu Sep 02, 2010 10:47 pm

Eric -

I think that there is at least one other set of Kottons that is more than 80% complete.

As for Mino's and VE's, I don't think that any checklist (especially the SCD) is accurate. They simply took the Kotton known issues and copied them over. I would bet that if a real checklist of verifiable examples were made for either issue, it would be considerably shorter.
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Re: T Card Set building

Post by crazylocomerk on Thu Sep 02, 2010 11:32 pm

rman444 wrote:Eric -

I think that there is at least one other set of Kottons that is more than 80% complete.

As for Mino's and VE's, I don't think that any checklist (especially the SCD) is accurate. They simply took the Kotton known issues and copied them over. I would bet that if a real checklist of verifiable examples were made for either issue, it would be considerably shorter.

Thanks Richard for that info. Good to know that there are at least 2 Kotton sets out there with 80%+ completed. I hope to have a set up to that mark....one day in this lifetime.
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Re: T Card Set building

Post by r337man on Fri Sep 03, 2010 12:51 pm

I have been half ass working on T202 for years. Though I am working on a master set, I think it is a tad more difficult than expected. The T201 is very easy, I think there is one fairly tough common and that is it. Dan.

I forgot to ask: Am I banned from this board?
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Re: T Card Set building

Post by fisherboy7 on Fri Sep 03, 2010 1:53 pm

Hi Dan, why on earth would you have been banned? Aside from the spammers, we've only had to ban one person since the forum was created ~3 years ago. You are a valued member here and your input is always welcomed and appreciated.

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Re: T Card Set building

Post by bowlingshoeguy on Fri Sep 03, 2010 4:19 pm

I think if you are adding all the back variations that the T202 set with the black 30 backs really falls down the charts. I have tracking those backs for over 5 years and only tracked 56 of them with some duplicates, so if all cards exist with this back they are really tough to find. The Matty/Devlin (giants) variations are a real pain to find.

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